alternate enclosure - New Media Show

Podcasting has one advantage that much of digital media struggles to maintain: trust.

In Episode #683 of the New Media Show, Rob Greenlee talks with Mike Kadin, CEO and co-founder of RedCircle. What does that trust mean for podcast advertising as AI, video, HLS, YouTube, Spotify, and changing audience behavior reshape the business?

Long-form shows create a different relationship between creators and audiences than short-form social content. That relationship has always been one of the reasons host-read podcast advertising can work so well.

But what happens when AI can recreate the host’s voice?

Mike makes an important distinction. The value of a host-read ad is not simply hearing a familiar voice. It comes from the host’s language, personality, experience, humor, and actual judgment about the product. RedCircle does not use AI-generated versions of creators to perform host-read advertising.

Mike believes cloning the host’s voice without the actual human endorsement could undermine the very trust that makes the advertising valuable.

Authentic Host Reads Still Matter

Rob and Mike talk about the difference between reading advertising copy and genuinely recommending something a creator has used.

RedCircle has seen similar shows, with similar audience sizes, run by the same advertiser and using the same talking points, produce very different results. One of the biggest differences can be the quality and believability of the host read.

That also puts responsibility on creators to work with products they can credibly talk about.

Mike explains that RedCircle will sometimes hear from a creator who tried a sponsor’s product and did not like it.

Rather than force an endorsement, the company can take that feedback back to the advertiser and cancel the spot. That kind of process helps protect the relationship between the creator and audience.

Using AI to Find Better Brand Matches

Mike also talks about a newer RedCircle capability called Show IQ.

Over the years of running campaigns, RedCircle has accumulated information on its creators’ interests and brand affinities, as well as historical campaign performance. Show IQ uses that information to help identify creators who may be a natural fit for a particular advertiser.

This is an example of AI being used behind the scenes to improve the match rather than replacing the human doing the endorsement. The goal is to put advertisers with creators who can actually speak credibly about their products.

Spotify, YouTube and Control of Podcast Monetization

The conversation shifts to the growing influence of large consumption platforms. Spotify is experimenting with ways for listeners to move past advertising more easily. YouTube has already offered similar jump-ahead behavior around portions of videos that viewers commonly skip.

Mike does not see this as some unexpected attack on podcasting. Spotify and YouTube have built massive distribution platforms and naturally want to control more of the economics that happen inside them.

For creators, diversification becomes increasingly important.

A creator can use YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and other platforms for distribution, but should also keep building direct relationships through websites, newsletters, subscriptions, and communities. No single distribution platform can be expected to always put the creator’s interests first.

RedCircle Is Moving Into Video

RedCircle has also started expanding beyond its traditional audio focus. Creators can now upload video through RedCircle and send it to YouTube, an expansion of its earlier audio-to-YouTube tools.

Mike says YouTube was the obvious first priority because that is where the largest existing video audience is today. RedCircle is also watching Spotify video, Apple Podcasts video, and HLS as podcasting becomes increasingly multi-format. The advertising systems will eventually need to evolve along with the content.

HLS Creates New Advertising Questions

A significant part of the conversation focuses on HLS and Apple’s new video-podcast approach in this episode.

Podcast advertising has traditionally been built around audio downloads. The video introduces a much more complex environment.

An Apple Podcasts episode may still automatically download its audio before the listener ever presses play.

If that listener later watches the video version, the advertising decision may already have been made. That makes traditional real-time programmatic video advertising harder to apply to podcast video.

For now, audio advertising may become a common advertising format, whether someone is listening or watching. That works technically, but it is not necessarily the best video experience.

Rob and Mike discuss the need for a new type of podcast video advertising that works whether someone hears the ad, watches it, or moves between both experiences.

Audio and Video Are Converging, But Not Cleanly

Rob raises a question he is dealing with directly on the New Media Show. Should a show have one combined audio-video experience, or should creators continue producing separate audio versions?

The New Media Show has distributed separate audio and video feeds for years. HLS makes it easier to move between listening and viewing, but that convergence can also lead to compromises.

Great video production does not automatically guarantee the best audio experience. The reverse is also true. Mike agrees there is a reasonable argument for preserving more flexibility between the two formats.

Measurement Is Getting Harder

Podcast measurement was already complicated.

Now creators may have traditional podcast downloads, Spotify streams, YouTube views, Apple video consumption, social views, and various advertising impressions.

Those numbers do not all mean the same thing. That creates an operational problem for creators trying to sell advertising and for brands trying to understand what they purchased. Mike believes technology needs to simplify this increasingly fragmented environment.

Mike compares it to the music industry, where tools were developed to distribute music and aggregate results across many different services. Creator media increasingly needs the same kind of cross-platform infrastructure.

What Is a Podcast Now? The episode also returns to a question the New Media Show has discussed for years.

What exactly is a podcast? Mike admits he has two answers.

As a longtime software engineer and RSS believer, Mike still thinks of a podcast as episodic media distributed through RSS.

As the CEO of a podcast technology and advertising company, he sees younger people entering the business who do not know what RSS is and think of a podcast as the kind of long-form conversational content they see on YouTube.

At some point, audience behavior begins defining the medium.

Rob and Mike also discuss industry efforts such as the AMP work around definitions and measurement.

Mike supports efforts to build standards but says they only become truly meaningful if the major platforms where people actually consume podcasts implement them.

Where Podcasting Goes Next

Mike believes the industry has to follow audience behavior. Creators are becoming multi-channel because audiences already are.

Audio, video, YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, RSS apps, and social platforms are increasingly parts of the same creator-media business. The opportunity is to build better tools that allow creators to distribute, monetize, and measure it all without having to manage the complexity themselves.

HLS is one part of that transition.

The larger change is podcasting becoming a much broader medium for audio and video creators while trying to preserve the trust that made it valuable in the first place.

Discussion Highlights:

– Why long-form podcasting creates deeper audience trust
– Why authentic host reads still perform
– AI-generated advertising and creator voice cloning
– Why RedCircle does not use synthetic host reads
– RedCircle Show IQ and better creator-brand matching
– Dynamic versus baked-in podcast advertising
– Spotify and YouTube gaining more monetization control
– Why creators need direct audience relationships
– RedCircle’s move into video
– Why YouTube was its first video priority
– HLS and podcast video advertising
– Audio versus video ad creative
– Separate audio and video podcast experiences
– Cross-platform measurement problems
– Alternate enclosures and adoption
– What defines a podcast now
– The need for meaningful industry standards
– The future of multi-channel podcast monetization

Chapter Timestamp Markers

00:00 Podcasting, trust and long-form media
01:00 Introducing Mike Kadin of RedCircle
02:00 Why trust matters in podcast advertising
03:20 AI-generated ads and audience trust
06:10 Why RedCircle avoids cloned host reads
09:00 Authentic creator endorsements
11:00 Why some host reads outperform others
12:20 RedCircle Show IQ
14:00 The future of host-read advertising
15:30 Dynamic versus baked-in ads
17:20 Spotify and ad skipping
21:00 YouTube and platform control
22:20 Creators need direct audience relationships
24:00 RedCircle moves further into video
26:30 HLS and podcast video advertising
31:00 Opportunities for video host-read advertising
33:00 Ads that work in audio and video
36:30 Separate audio and video feeds
40:00 The fragmented consumption experience
42:00 Podcast measurement gets more complicated
44:30 HLS and alternate enclosures
47:20 What is a podcast now?
52:00 Standards and the major platforms
54:00 Measuring advertising by performance
56:00 The multi-channel future of podcasting
58:00 Closing thoughts

Mike Kadin Guest Links

RedCircle: https://redcircle.com

Host and Show Links

New Media Show
https://newmediashow.com

New Media Show on YouTube
https://youtube.com/@TheNewMediaShow

Rob Greenlee
https://robgreenlee.com

Rob Greenlee on LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/robgreenlee

Podcast Hall of Fame
https://podcasthall.com

AI Disclosure

AI tools were used to assist with organizing and editing to remove filler words; this episode description was created from the completed full transcript of episode #683. The recorded conversation, human performances, perspectives, editorial direction, and final responsibility for the episode remain with Rob Greenlee and Mike Kadin. The New Media Show is human-hosted.

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If you are trying to understand where podcasting is going in 2026 and beyond, this is one of those conversations that clarifies the whole board.

On Episode 657 of The New Media Show, Host Rob Greenlee shares a microphone and a video camera with Justin Jackson, CEO and Co-Founder of Transistor.fm, to unpack two forces reshaping the medium at the same time: Apple’s push back into video podcasts using HLS streaming, and the accelerating rise of synthetic creators and human clones powered by AI.

The real takeaway in this episode is that this is no longer just a podcasting story. It’s a media transformation story, and creators who treat it that way will have the advantage.

Justin brings a rare combination to this topic because he is not just watching the ecosystem from the outside. He is building one of the most respected independent podcast hosting platforms and is deeply involved in coordinating the industry’s progress through the Podcast Standards Project.

One of the most useful parts of this episode is hearing how standards actually get adopted. Podcasting has a coordination problem, and the only way the open ecosystem keeps evolving is when hosting providers, apps, and major platforms agree on what becomes “standard.” Justin explains why this work is slower than people want and why it matters, using real examples such as transcript support and creator-recommendation tooling via Podroll.

From there, we go straight into the big shift: Apple leaning harder into video again, this time through HLS. The practical impact for creators is obvious. Video becomes easier to distribute, monetize, and measure across platforms.

The strategic impact is bigger. Apple’s move creates a cascade effect. As more hosts build HLS workflows, those streams can increasingly appear not only within Apple’s experience but also through open standards like alternate enclosures, especially if apps continue to adopt them. Justin is bullish on RSS-based open podcasting surviving, not because it is nostalgic, but because consumer demand and creator distribution needs keep pulling it forward.

A core theme in this episode is that creators and consumers decide what “a podcast” is, not the industry. Justin puts it plainly: if everyday listeners think podcasts are something they watch on YouTube, that belief drives behavior, and behavior drives platforms. This is why the listen-and-watch switching paradigm matters. Consumers want to start in audio and seamlessly jump into video. That pressure changes production habits over time, because the “audio from the video” becomes the default in many workflows. For some audio-first producers, that feels like a loss. For video-first creators, it is an opportunity to build a more fluid media experience that meets people where they are, whether they are watching closely or listening in the background.

Rob and Justin also dig into a topic most platforms are not talking about enough: demographics and attention. Apple Podcasts remains a valuable audience, often older, higher-income, harder-to-reach, and premium-friendly. But YouTube and short-form feeds have already shaped younger consumer habits.

Justin raises an interesting possibility that a backlash is forming among Gen Z against addictive, brain-rotting feeds. If that continues, there is a real opening for more mindful media experiences, which could benefit audio- and podcast-style consumption and even give Apple an unexpected positioning angle if they choose to lean into it.

Then move into the other major shift: synthetic creators, AI cloning, and AI-generated media at scale. We talk about what is real, what is hype, and what’s already happening in the market. Justin’s perspective is grounded: audiences still choose what they care about, and a lot of AI-generated “slop” is being produced with no real demand. At the same time, I warn that this is the worst the tech will ever be, and that quality is moving fast.

The deeper layer is that AI is already part of the content distribution pipeline, because algorithms decide what gets surfaced and recommended.

As cloning and synthetic production improve, trust and identification become the bigger story. If people cannot tell what is real, standards for disclosure, verification, and labeling become essential to preserve credibility.

This episode ultimately lands on a simple reality: creators do not need to panic, but they do need to adapt. Video is becoming a default entry point. RSS is still resilient, but platform native APIs are expanding. AI will increase volume, forcing platforms to filter more aggressively. The winning creators will be the ones who build trust, produce content people actually want, and package it so it travels across environments without losing the core promise that made the audience show up in the first place.

Quick answers

What does Apple HLS video mean for podcast creators in 2026?
It signals a stronger platform push toward seamless listen-and-watch experiences, better measurement, and future monetization opportunities, and it pressures hosts and apps to support HLS workflows more broadly.

Is RSS dying because platforms want APIs and direct uploads?
RSS remains highly resilient because creators want distribution portability and consumers want access to the shows they already follow. Platforms may add more native workflows, but RSS continues to power the open layer.

Will AI-generated creators replace humans?
AI will dramatically increase content volume, but audience trust and relevance will still determine what survives. The big shift is that trust, verification, and disclosure become more important as synthetic media becomes harder to detect.

Chapters:

00:00 Welcome and big shifts

01:13 Meet Justin Jackson

02:50 Why podcast standards matter

06:23 Apple HLS video ripple

10:34 Transistor distribution view

13:24 Video podcasting history

17:09 Why the video faded to audio

22:30 YouTube wins attention

29:33 Apple subscriptions and TV

35:57 Demographics and Gen Z

39:03 Mindful media backlash

43:32 Apple culture and video

45:44 Retro tech resistance

46:50 Apple Ads And Privacy

47:40 HLS Rollout And Ad Load

49:25 Will RSS Survive Platforms

50:25 Why RSS Keeps Winning

54:17 Open Standards Like Email

59:16 Gen Z Video Threat

01:01:01 HLS Video Via RSS

01:04:40 Audio Video Switching Pain

01:07:53 Creators Adapt To Fluid Media

01:19:09 Consumers Define Podcasts

01:24:10 AI Voices Enter Podcasting

01:25:16 Reid Hoffman Digital Twin

01:28:17 AI Video Not Live

01:28:46 Latency And Real Time Avatars

01:29:08 Julia McCoy Avatar Demo

01:32:31 Do Audiences Care

01:33:28 AI Lowers Creation Bar

01:35:41 Real Humans Still Win

01:38:20 Noise Raises The Bar

01:40:53 AI For AI Audiences

01:47:39 Deepfake Hype Check

01:50:32 Trust And Disclosure Standards

01:52:19 Platform Overload From Slop

02:00:00 Pulia Spam Example

02:02:57 Throttling And Verification

02:08:27 Wrap Up And HLS Updates

Links

Guest Justin Jackson Links

Transistor.fm: https://transistor.fm/
Justin Jackson: https://justinjackson.ca/

Host Rob Greenlee and Show Links
New Media Show: https://newmediashow.com/
Rob Greenlee: https://robgreenlee.com/
Trust Factor Lab: https://trustfactorlab.com/
Adore Creator Network: https://adorenetwork.com/
Podcast Hall of Fame: https://podcasthall.com/
Rob Greenlee YouTube: https://youtube.com/@robgreenlee
Rob Greenlee LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/robgreenlee
Rob Greenlee Instagram: https://instagram.com/robwgreenlee

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